Tier One Interview: Josh Caron

This month, Jay sits down with Josh Caron, Vice President of Government Relations at M Financial Group, where he built and now leads the producer group's advocacy effort from the ground up. Josh contends that the tax treatment holding up nearly every life insurance strategy is a live political variable the industry cannot afford to treat as permanent, and that the micro threats it tracks, to private placement, grantor and dynasty trusts, and estate planning, are downstream of macro forces most clients never see: a growing national debt, persistent deficits, an aging population, and a more populist politics on both sides.

Josh walks through what government relations actually looks like day to day, why credibility is the only currency that moves policymakers, and why the individual producer back home is a more persuasive advocate than any lobbyist in Washington. He also makes an unusually hopeful case for the country's resilience, from someone who has spent a career watching its politics up close. Plus, the infamous restaurant question, where Josh admits how much of Washington's real business gets done over a steak before steering Jay firmly away from every steakhouse in town. Read on to learn more!

JAY: Given that so much of what makes life insurance a solution for so many families and businesses depends on the tax treatment, knowing that our industry has government relationship experts like you, Josh, is reassuring.  We are going to discuss the importance of your work for our industry but, first, talk about your role at M Financial Group, a prominent producer group.

JOSH: Jay, thank you for having me. I’m honored to be included in a series that has featured so many accomplished leaders from across our profession.

For readers who may not be familiar with M Financial, we are a community of independent Member Firms that serve successful families, business owners, executives, and institutions across the country. While many people associate life insurance with a policy itself, our Member Firms are really helping clients solve much broader challenges -protecting families, preserving businesses, creating opportunities for future generations, and bringing certainty to life's most important financial decisions.

One of the things that attracted me to M is that advocacy has always been part of our culture. Our Member Firms advocate for their clients every day - whether that means negotiating with carriers, navigating a complex underwriting process, or designing sophisticated planning solutions. We simply extend that same mindset into the public policy arena.

Three years ago, M asked me to build and lead our government relations effort. In practice, that means helping the organization understand how legislative and regulatory developments may affect our Member Firms and their clients, developing policy positions, working alongside our trade association partners, engaging directly with policymakers, and creating opportunities for our Members to participate in the advocacy process themselves.

The reality is that many of the promises our industry makes to families and businesses rely on a stable legal and regulatory framework. My job is to help ensure that when a client needs a solution years, or even decades, from now it works exactly as intended. Some days that involves strategy, some days policy development, some days relationship building. It's a fascinating role because it sits at the intersection of business, public policy, and human impact.

JAY: Just like most people as a child do not envision themselves as a life insurance producer, you didn’t see yourself immersed in politics, did you? How did you end up as an advocate and, specifically, advocating for life insurance?

JOSH: Not at all, Jay. I don't think many grade school kids dream about becoming a tax lobbyist!

What I was always interested in was history, government, and how decisions get made. I've always been fascinated by the fact that a relatively small number of people, making decisions in a room somewhere, can profoundly impact millions of lives. That intersection of policy and real-world consequences has always intrigued me.

My career began in politics, working around campaigns, government, and public policy. Over time, I came to realize that some of the most meaningful policy work happens outside of government itself. Businesses, trade associations, nonprofits, and advocacy organizations all play an important role in helping policymakers understand how laws and regulations affect real people.

Prior to joining M Financial, I worked at Finseca, the leading trade association representing financial security professionals. I was naturally drawn to the profession because of my own family's experience with life insurance.

My Pepe, my grandfather, passed away suddenly from a heart attack at age 51. He left behind a wife, twelve children, and limited financial resources. What allowed my family to stay together under the roof he built for them? Life insurance. Long before I understood the technical aspects of our business, I understood the difference it can make in people's lives.

When the opportunity at M Financial arose, I was intrigued because life insurance sits at the intersection of so many important issues: family protection, retirement security, small business planning, employee benefits, and wealth preservation. Every policy debate ultimately comes back to people trying to provide for their families, protect their businesses, and create opportunities for future generations.

What keeps me engaged today is that our work is not theoretical. The decisions made in Washington or in a state capitol eventually affect real families sitting across the table from our Member Firms. When viewed through that lens, advocacy becomes very personal, and I’ve loved my career so far because of it.

JAY: From my years of industry advocacy, I have been familiar with life insurance companies investing in government relations employees. What prompted M Financial Group to add your role to the organization and how does M Financial hope to benefit?

JOSH: Since our founding 48 years ago, M has always believed in protecting the interests of our Member Firms and their clients. We've consistently invested in industry partnerships and public policy engagement because we recognize that great client outcomes depend on more than just great planning.

Three years ago, M decided to further demonstrate that commitment by investing in dedicated internal government relations capabilities. As legislative and regulatory debates accelerated and became increasingly complex, we saw an opportunity to strengthen our ability to anticipate challenges, shape policy discussions, and ensure our community's voice was heard at every level of government.

Our Member Firms serve highly successful families, business owners, executives, and institutions. The solutions they provide depend upon a stable and predictable legislative and regulatory environment. Whether the issue is taxation, retirement policy, wealth transfer, executive benefits, or insurance regulation, decisions made in Washington and state capitols can have a meaningful impact on clients and businesses.

The goal is not simply to play defense. Certainly, there are times when we must oppose proposals that could negatively affect our clients or profession. But some of our most important work involves helping policymakers better understand our industry, identifying opportunities to improve public policy, and ensuring our Member Firms have a seat at the table when important decisions are being made.

At the end of the day, government relations is simply another way we create value for our Member Firms. Just as they advocate for their clients, M advocates for the broader environment that allows those clients to succeed.

JAY:  I am curious about your day-to-day activities.  You are not just on the phone all the time trying to reach legislators to explain the benefits of life insurance, are you?  How are you effective in your position?

JOSH: I think people sometimes picture lobbying as walking the halls of Congress all day. There is certainly some of that, but the reality is much more relationship-driven and much less transactional than many people imagine.

A typical day might involve monitoring legislation, coordinating with trade associations, meeting with policymakers, helping draft comments on regulations, preparing executives for meetings, speaking with Member Firms about emerging issues, or developing long-term advocacy strategies. A lot of time is spent gathering information and connecting dots.

Josh and New Hampshire Senator Maggie Hassan.

The most important lesson I have learned is that credibility is everything. Policymakers are inundated with information and competing viewpoints. The organizations that have influence are the ones that consistently provide thoughtful, factual, and constructive input.

Advocacy is a lot like relationship management. You cannot wait until you need something to build the relationship. The strongest relationships are built over years through trust, consistency, and a willingness to engage even when there is no immediate benefit.

Perhaps most importantly, our role is not simply to tell policymakers what we think. It is equally important to listen, understand their priorities, and identify areas where solutions can be developed. The best advocacy is usually collaborative rather than confrontational.

JAY:  When we talked a few weeks ago, I asked you about what issues you and, frankly, anyone in our industry should be vigilant about.  You said that you sort the issues into “macro” and “micro” categories.  Can you elaborate about that?

JOSH: When I think about public policy, you’re right, I try to separate issues into two buckets: macro trends and micro issues.

The micro issues are the ones our industry spends most of its time discussing. Those include proposals affecting the tax treatment of life insurance, private placement life insurance, grantor trusts, dynasty trusts, estate planning techniques, executive benefits, and other specific planning strategies. These are the issues that directly impact our clients and our businesses.

But I think it is a mistake to look at those issues in isolation. To understand where the micro issues are headed, you have to understand the macro environment that is producing them.

At the macro level, the United States faces several significant long-term challenges. We have a growing national debt, persistent budget deficits, an aging population, rising entitlement obligations, and interest costs on the national debt that are becoming one of the largest line items in the federal budget. Regardless of political party, those realities will increasingly force policymakers to ask difficult questions about spending, taxation, and revenue generation.

At the same time, we've seen both political parties become more populist in different ways. There is greater scrutiny of wealth concentration, tax preferences, large institutions, and perceived inequities within the tax code. As policymakers search for revenue or seek to address those concerns, they naturally look toward areas involving wealthy families, successful businesses, and sophisticated planning strategies.

That is where the micro issues emerge. Discussions around life insurance taxation, private placement life insurance, trust structures, estate planning, and wealth transfer techniques do not happen in a vacuum. They are often downstream of larger debates about fiscal policy, demographics, economic mobility, and government revenues.

The good news is that life insurance remains uniquely aligned with many public policy objectives. It encourages long-term planning, provides financial security to families, supports business continuity, and helps individuals take responsibility for their own financial futures. Our job as an industry is to continue educating policymakers on those benefits while remaining engaged in the conversations shaping the future of the tax code and financial services marketplace.

JAY: It is fair to say that the U.S. seems to be dividing up along political lines, and, at times, the future of our country seems uncertain. You gave me a bit of a pep talk that changed my perception and I would love for you to share your personal view on this.

JOSH: I think it's important to start by acknowledging that many of the frustrations people feel today are real. Americans have legitimate concerns about the cost of living, the national debt, public safety, economic opportunity, political institutions, and the future we're leaving to our children. Those concerns shouldn't be dismissed, and I understand why many people feel frustrated with our politics.

At the same time, I remain incredibly optimistic about our country.

One of the advantages of spending my career around government and politics, seeing it firsthand behind the scenes, is that it gives you a longer historical perspective. When we look at today's headlines, it's easy to convince ourselves that division is something new or uniquely dangerous. The reality is that America has endured periods of disagreement, political turmoil, and national uncertainty throughout its history. In some cases, the divisions were deeper and the stakes greater than what we face today.

What gives me confidence is that when I step away from social media, cable news, and political rhetoric, I see something very different. Most Americans are raising families, building businesses, volunteering in their communities, attending religious services, coaching youth sports, and trying to leave things a little better than they found them. The people we work with, worship with, coach alongside, and live next door to often have far more in common than our politics would suggest.

I also think one of the great strengths of our republic is that it was never designed to require unanimous agreement. Our system was built to manage disagreement. Democracy is not the absence of conflict; it's the ability to work through those disagreements peacefully while continuing to move forward together. That resilience is one of the reasons the American experiment has endured for 250 years.

If I worry about anything, it's the temptation to disengage. When people become frustrated and angry, the natural instinct is often to tune out, retreat into like-minded circles, or assume their participation doesn't matter. I believe the opposite is true. The best version of our country is unlocked when citizens lean in - when they stay informed, engage respectfully, listen to people with different perspectives, and participate in their communities and institutions.

Whether we're talking about government, advocacy, or the life insurance profession, the same principle applies: meaningful outcomes are shaped by people who show up. The future of our country won't be determined by the loudest voices on television or social media. It will be determined by millions of ordinary Americans who choose to remain engaged, empathetic, and committed to the communities they call home.

That may sound idealistic coming from someone who works in politics, but I genuinely believe our democracy remains one of the most remarkable and resilient institutions ever created. The responsibility we all share is not to withdraw from it, but to embrace being as active as possible in it.

JAY:  Why is it important for the individual life insurance producer to dedicate time to advocacy and how can they start?

JOSH: I think the first thing producers need to understand is that they are far more valuable to the policymaking process than they realize.

Most legislators have never sat across the table from a family planning for the future. They've never helped a business owner protect a company they've spent decades building. They've never delivered a death claim, designed an executive benefits plan, or seen firsthand the difference financial security can make during life's most difficult moments. Our Member Firms and financial professionals across the industry bring real-world experiences and expertise that policymakers simply do not have.

One of my favorite sayings in advocacy is that if you're not at the table, you're probably on the menu. Decisions are going to get made whether we participate or not. The question is whether policymakers hear from the professionals who work directly with families and businesses every day or from others who may have a very different perspective on our profession and the value it provides.

The good news is that engagement doesn't require someone to become a political expert or spend weeks walking the halls of Congress. It starts with building relationships, sharing expertise, and becoming a trusted resource to elected officials when issues affecting clients and communities arise.

For producers looking to get involved, organizations like Finseca have done an outstanding job creating pathways for engagement through programs like the Ambassador Program, which helps financial security professionals build relationships with policymakers and participate in the legislative process. Those efforts are critically important because the most effective advocate for our profession is often not a lobbyist in Washington, but a practitioner back home who can explain how public policy affects real families, businesses, and communities.

At M, we've sought to complement those efforts through initiatives like our elite invite only Capitol Forum, which brings Member Firm leaders to Washington to meet directly with policymakers, hear from national thought leaders, and shape the future of the profession. One of the most rewarding parts of my job is watching someone attend their first advocacy event and realize that their voice, experience, and expertise genuinely matter.

At its core, advocacy is not about politics. It's about stewardship. We have all benefited from a profession that helps families protect what matters most, and I believe we have a responsibility to help ensure those solutions remain available for future generations. The first step is simply showing up and being part of the conversation.

JAY:  Knowing that you have a five-year-old daughter and having leisure time seems like a thing of the past, how do you spend time outside of work?

JOSH: Leisure time? What is that, Jay?

One of the things that surprised me most about becoming a parent was how much of your personal autonomy disappears overnight. Your schedule is no longer your own, your priorities change, and suddenly your weekends revolve around someone else's interests and activities. That said, I wouldn't change a thing. My wife Andrea and my daughter Maggie are the center of my world and the greatest source of joy in my life.

When I'm not working, I've actually become a bit of a homebody. I enjoy cooking, hosting friends and family, and finding excuses to gather people around a table. Some of my favorite evenings are the simplest ones - a meal on the patio, a glass of wine, good conversation, and nowhere else we need to be.

I've always loved history and reading, particularly biographies and historical nonfiction. I spend enough time thinking about where our country is headed that I enjoy reading about how we got here in the first place. Music is another constant companion, whether I'm working around the house, cooking dinner, or sitting on the patio after a long day.

I also enjoy staying active. Running has become an important outlet for me, both for fitness and for mental clarity. Whether it's a local race or just a few quiet miles before the rest of the house wakes up, it's often the best part of my day.

Travel is something our family values deeply. Last year we took Maggie to Ireland for her first international trip, and seeing a new country through a child's eyes was a reminder of how much wonder there still is in the world. We're already looking ahead to future adventures, with Sweden and Portugal high on the list.

And like many homeowners, I seem to spend a surprising amount of time gardening, working on projects around our nearly 100-year-old home, and convincing myself that this weekend will finally be the weekend everything gets done. So far, that strategy hasn't worked particularly well.

JAY:  Josh, this has been great and, personally, I am happy and relieved to have you as an advocate for the life insurance industry. I think we lucked out!  Turning to our restaurant question, you pointed out that not only are steak houses favored in the life insurance world but that a lot of what is accomplished in Washington D.C. happens at steak houses!  

Without naming a steak restaurant or a steak dish, give me some recommendations of where I should go and what I should order when I am there.

JOSH: If you'll allow me, Jay, I'm going to cheat and give you two answers.

There's a prevailing belief that everything important in Washington happens on the National Mall or in the steakhouses surrounding it. While I've certainly spent my fair share of evenings in those establishments, some of my favorite places are found away from the political spotlight.

One of those is Red Hen in the historic Bloomingdale neighborhood. It's the kind of restaurant that reminds you there is a real city beyond the monuments and government buildings. The atmosphere is warm, unpretentious, and distinctly neighborhood-oriented. My recommendation: ask for the cacio e pepe. It's not listed on the menu, but if you're lucky enough to get it, you'll understand why it's become something of a local institution.

My second choice is Chez Billy Sud in Georgetown, one of my favorite neighborhoods anywhere in the country and a fantastic French restaurant. Most people focus on the dining room, but I would encourage you to make your way to the bar. Between the exposed brick, dark wood, wood fireplace and intimate atmosphere, it feels like a place where stories have been exchanged for generations. Order a cocktail, enjoy a glass of wine, and settle in for the evening.

One of the things I love most about Washington is that beneath the politics, there is an incredible city filled with history, culture, and remarkable people. Some of my best conversations in Washington have happened far away from hearing rooms, committee meetings, or policy debates. A good meal, good company, and a little perspective can go a long way toward softening the rough-and-tumble nature of the nation's capital.

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Since its inception, Life Insurance Strategies Group has solely focused on the individual high net worth life insurance market. We do not sell products. This allows us to offer unbiased, pragmatic advice. Visit us at www.lifeinsurancestrategiesgroup.com.