Tier One Interview: Donna Williams

This month, Jay sits down with Donna Williams, CLU®, ChFC®, ChSNC®, Regional Director, Member Firm Development, M Financial Group.  The pair discuss Donna's truly unique road to her current position, finding opportunity in non-traditional markets, the importance of strong support systems, and pizza!

JAY: Congratulations on being fast-tracked to the Tier One Interview Series, Donna!  Our readers should know that I only recently met you in June at the VIE International PPLI Forum in London.  Your colleague and someone I’ve known for 25 years, Dennis McMahan, introduced us and you and I had a few fascinating and candid conversations about the high-net-worth life insurance market.  Only minutes into our conversation, I knew you belonged among our Interviewees.

VIE International is one of the firms you cover for M Financial Group.  Tell me about your role at one of the industry’s oldest and most reputable producer groups.

DONNA: I can’t tell you how thrilled and humbled I am to be included in your Tier One Interview series - it’s truly an honor! I’m looking forward to sharing some of the experiences that have shaped my path, and I hope it contributes real value to your series!

Let me begin by saying, I truly enjoy what I do. As Regional Director, I serve as the primary liaison between M Financial Group and our Member Firms, playing a pivotal role in shaping a truly collaborative partnership experience. Together with my regional team, I focus on understanding the unique needs and challenges of each firm and ensuring they receive strategic resources, insights, and solutions tailored for maximum impact. Our goal is to elevate the Member Firm experience by building strong relationships and becoming a trusted extension of their teams. We accomplish this through what we call our three pillars of success: Ambassadorship, Advocacy, and Accountability.

Ambassadorship means representing M Financial and its vast network of resources to deliver a world-class experience for every Member Firm. This role connects M Financial, our carrier partners, and the entire M Community, serving as a conduit for collaboration and the seamless exchange of ideas. It’s about facilitating solutions, resolving challenges, and fostering growth at every level.

Advocacy focuses on people, process, and products. By partnering closely with each firm to understand their markets, specialties, and team dynamics, I can lead more meaningful discussions that identify gaps and uncover new opportunities for success. Advocacy ensures the interests of our firms remain at the forefront of everything we do.

Accountability provides the structure to protect and advance those interests. It empowers my team to deliver accurate, client-driven solutions and reinforces our commitment to integrity and excellence.

Through these pillars, my mission is simple: to strengthen partnerships, create value, and help our Member Firms thrive.

JAY:  When I ask interviewees this second question about their path to where they are today in the top tier of the life insurance industry, I often find they started in one career and ended up in life insurance by accident.  You have that component, but you made a decision at a very young age that nearly derailed your future.  What happened and how did you overcome your circumstances to get to this point?

DONNA: Jay, as I mentioned during our conversation, I don’t shy away from my past. In fact, I embrace it because it keeps me grounded. My teenage years were anything but easy. Being the only girl with four brothers taught me to be strong and resilient at a very young age. Still, I often felt out of place, especially in school. No matter how hard I tried, school was a constant challenge.

There were days I made excuses not to go or even left home pretending I was on my way, only to skip altogether. Ironically, I was a good student, earning A’s and B’s, but I drove my parents crazy. They tried everything, even enrolling me in private school, which was a huge sacrifice with five kids at home.

Despite their efforts, at 14, I dropped out. Deep down, I knew it wasn’t the right choice, but at the time it felt like my escape. When you’re picked on, it takes a toll. You internalize so much, and your self-esteem suffers. Avoiding school was my way of coping with that.

Fast forward a few years, I turned things around. I enrolled in community college and earned my high school diploma, a milestone that marked the beginning of a new chapter in my life.

Around this time, my father and I launched a small cleaning business. I was just 17 years old. At first, we cleaned just about anything—offices, condos, you name it. Then, one day, we were asked to clean a movie theater. That one request changed everything. It became the foundation of what would eventually grow into a million-dollar company specializing in theater cleaning.

Cleaning theaters was a completely different world compared to traditional office cleaning. Offices are predictable as they have the same 50 people, Monday through Friday, year-round.

Theaters, however, were a different story. They operate seven days a week, which meant no weekends off. Weekday attendance was light—sometimes just a handful of people in each auditorium. But on weekends, it could explode to thousands of guests in a single location. That’s a much different dynamic than 50 office employees. Learning to manage that extreme fluctuation became our specialty.

I worked five years straight without a day off, but our hard work paid off. Even at a small scale, I was earning more than many college graduates. Running the business gave me a crash course in leadership, including contract negotiations, hiring and managing staff, and stepping in to clean when we were short-handed.

When I met my husband, everything changed again. With his technology background, we streamlined operations, added efficiencies, and scaled quickly, going from six employees to over 150, with contracts in three states. Despite our success, something always tugged at me: the dream of earning my college degree. I set it aside for years, throwing myself deeper into growing the business, but that desire never went away.

When my husband and I decided to start a family, we knew it would bring challenges. One of the biggest was figuring out how to keep the business running as our family dynamics shifted. I was deeply involved in the day-to-day operations, and it was hard to imagine stepping away.

At the time, demand for our services was strong, but it came with its share of growing pains, such as constant labor issues, ongoing training, and the pressures of rapid growth. All of it was beginning to take a toll.

Then life changed in ways I could never have anticipated. After a brief illness, my father passed away. I was devastated. My father was my best friend. My mother had been diagnosed with a terminal illness three years prior to that. It felt like everything was shifting all at once. During all this, I met someone who would open the door for me to discover the life insurance industry.

When I began exploring benefit options for both my business and my family, I met a New York Life agent, Jim Griffin. Jim helped me navigate everything—health, life, disability, and employee benefits—and, over time, he became more than just an advisor; he became a friend. One day, as my husband and I were reviewing options, Jim asked me a simple yet intriguing question: “What do you think about what I do?”

That question stayed with me. I admired the fact that his work allowed him to help people mitigate risks and protect what mattered most. At that time, we had closed our business, and I was searching for my next chapter. But if I’m perfectly honest, becoming a life insurance agent was truly not on my radar. At that time, I knew very little about life insurance. However, I have always believed in the power of commitment and stepping into new opportunities with courage. So, I decided to pursue a career as a New York Life agent.

My time with New York Life taught me the fundamentals of the life insurance industry and gave me the opportunity to do something I loved – to meet people, learn their stories, and help them achieve their goals. I’ve often been told that I’ve never met a stranger, and in this role, that was an asset. I wasn’t just selling policies; I was making a difference.

After a few years, however, change came again. Having both my husband and me in commission-only roles was challenging, so when an opportunity opened in the life insurance division at TIAA, I took it.

For over 15 years, I thrived at TIAA. The culture aligned with who I am at my core. I’ve always wanted to help people make informed decisions rather than simply telling them what to do. At TIAA, I found that purpose. I consistently ranked in the top three for life insurance sales, and I broadened my expertise by learning the retirement side of the business. This holistic perspective allowed me to understand how life insurance fits into overall financial planning.

Eventually, I moved into a role at TIAA as the internal wholesaler for the entire M Distribution team. This was a pivotal experience. It gave me a deep understanding of the unique life insurance needs in the high-net-worth space, as well as the complexities facing M Financial Member Firms.

Working at an organization like TIAA, which is deeply committed to education, reignited a personal goal of mine: earning my college degree. This decision was not without some very deep reflection. It had been a long road and many seasons of contemplation on that part of my life. I enrolled at the University of Phoenix, graduated with honors in business management, and delivered the commencement address to a crowd of 21,000 people. My speech was titled “Why Not Me?”—a true full-circle moment.

Donna with Head of Member Firm Services at M Financial Group, Brooke Zrno Grisham

As my time at TIAA came to a close, another door opened: M Financial Group. The transition felt natural. They were growing, and I was eager for a new opportunity. Having worked closely with their Member Firms, they knew my work ethic and dedication. It was the perfect next step.

My time with M has been both rewarding and transformative. The organization has given me the opportunity to grow, refine my expertise, and leverage a broader set of skills than ever before. Recently, I was honored to step into the role of Regional Director for the southern M Firms, a responsibility I take to heart. Every day, I focus on delivering world-class effort, building strong partnerships, and driving meaningful results.

JAY:  Your day-to-day job is to work with some of the successful life insurance producers and firms in the country.  I want to take advantage of your insights from this.  In your opinion, Donna, what are some of the prevalent characteristics of a successful firm?

DONNA: Jay, I spend a great deal of time visiting firms, engaging in conversations, listening, and observing operations firsthand. Through this work, I’ve gained insight into patterns that distinguish firms leading the way from those still in pursuit. However, this can be a delicate balance. What drives success in one firm may not necessarily translate for another. Recognizing these distinctions is critical to identifying best practices that truly fit a firm’s unique needs.

One common thread I’ve observed among high-performing firms is strong, intentional leadership. These leaders don’t just set the tone—they embed their values and vision into the entire organization. You see it reflected in every interaction, both internally and externally.

This goes beyond charisma. It’s evident in how associates feel included, motivated, and empowered. Engagement is high, which drives productivity and strengthens retention. These firms foster an environment where individual and collaborative success are both celebrated.

Successful firms also leave clear indicators of their commitment to excellence: they are customer-centric, leverage technology to enhance the client’s experience and streamline operations, provide personalized advice, and operate with the highest ethical standards.

Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, they remain relevant. They do this by being adaptable and proactive, anticipating market changes and evolving regulations, and positioning themselves ahead of the curve.

While there are many more nuances, these characteristics consistently show up among firms that truly set the standard for success.

Donna with Mary Jo and Ken Innis of The R.O.W. Group, an M Financial firm

JAY:   Despite all of the apparent success you encounter among top firms, I know you have some frustration.  We have talked in length about all the opportunities for firms to engage with new clients and to increase their new premium that are not being explored.  What are these opportunities?

DONNA: There’s a lot to unpack here. Most economic forecast models point to changing markets and conditions, but the real question is, how do we position our industry for continued growth and success? As markets evolve and diversify, I believe new opportunities will emerge that didn’t exist just a few years ago.

Two areas stand out as particularly promising: non-traditional businesses and the women’s market. Both are expanding at an unprecedented pace. It’s our responsibility to lead by example, to help clients build wealth across a broader spectrum of opportunities. Our economy, like our nation, is in the midst of a significant shift, creating new markets and streams of wealth.

Non-traditional businesses represent one of these emerging opportunities. Consider how careers like “influencer” or podcaster, once unimaginable, are now thriving. These entrepreneurial ventures will continue to grow, especially as AI accelerates innovation. Many of these businesses are still in their infancy, being created within an evolving digital economy. Their unique planning needs make them an untapped opportunity for wealth planning professionals.

The women’s market is another area positioned for exponential growth. Nearly 40% of U.S. businesses are now owned by women. According to a recent Wells Fargo report, from 2019 to 2023, women-owned businesses outpaced men’s in growth rates by 94.3% for number of firms, 252.8% for employment, and 82% for revenue—all during challenging economic conditions. This trend is expected to continue.

We live in a global economy shaped by diversity of experience and perspective. Our industry must embrace that reality by uncovering new markets and expanding our portfolios accordingly. The U.S. population is becoming more diverse across all age groups. Ignoring this fact and failing to diversify business opportunities would be shortsighted and potentially harmful to long-term success.

We must prepare for these shifts now by putting programs and resources in place to attract talent from diverse backgrounds. Doing so will enable firms to adapt, grow, and create new revenue streams, ensuring relevance in an evolving market. Limiting opportunities means limiting growth and, in today’s environment, that’s a risk no firm can afford to take.

JAY:   Your comments echo what my firm has been saying in our social media for years:  “Try selling to someone who isn’t like you!”  Let’s take this another step.  The life insurance industry, for the most part, lacks diversity.  To be fair, there are a number of producers, producer groups and carriers who would love to see this change but cannot seem to figure out how to attract and elevate women, people of color and folks from the LGBTQ+ community.   What are your thoughts on what can be done?

DONNA: Jay, this is a subject I take very personally. I’m part of one of these groups, and over the years I’ve built relationships across the industry with individuals from diverse backgrounds, many of whom are not only exceptional professionals but also close friends. They are talented, committed, and open to opportunity. The challenge isn’t a lack of ability; it’s our industry’s tendency to focus on differences rather than the incredible potential to build stronger, more well-rounded practices. We need to shift that mindset and partner with organizations that are leading the way on diversity.

Last year, I attended The Conference of African American Financial Professionals (CAAFP) hosted by The American College. For the first time, I was in a room filled with financial professionals who looked like me. The energy was inspiring. There were countless highly successful professionals, individuals who would be phenomenal additions to our firms and who bring a wealth of experience and knowledge that could transform the marketplace.

Prudential is another example of an organization taking meaningful steps. In 2024, the company hosted the annual Virago Women’s Leadership Summit where best practices for serving women clients and building firms positioned for success in this growing market were shared. They also champion initiatives like Blueprints to Black Wealth to help close the racial wealth gap. Similarly, Finseca’s Women’s Community offers powerful insights from some of the most accomplished women in our industry.

At M Financial, we’ve taken steps through our Magnet Program, which focuses on three areas: Recruiting, Development and Growth.   Recruiting means attracting new candidates from diverse backgrounds.  Development focuses on coaching and training both early-career professionals and seasoned individuals transitioning from other financial sectors.  Finally, growth comes from supporting current employees, such as case designers, for example, who aspire to become future producers.

But we need more initiatives like these, designed specifically to reach a broader, more diverse audience. Recruiting on college campuses, especially at Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs), can open doors to exceptional talent. Many of these individuals haven’t been exposed to our industry, so additional resources and education will be critical. This isn’t just about inclusion; it’s about securing the future of our profession by cultivating the next generation of financial professionals and firm leaders.

JAY:  If you don’t mind, Donna, I’m going to continue to drill down on this area.  A comment you made in our last conversation has stuck with me.  You said that at several steps in your life and career, fear kept you back.  Talk about this and how you overcame it because the Donna Williams I met in London was confident, engaging and incredibly knowledgeable about the high-net-worth life insurance market.  I cannot imagine anything holding you back!

DONNA: Thank you for the kind words, Jay. Some might say I’ve mastered the art of masking my fears, but imposter syndrome is very real. When I began my career in financial services, I was struck by how few people of color and women I saw in the space. While trying to find my footing, I asked the top-producing New York Life agent in my agency for advice. His response amplified my self-doubt. He told me I would always face an uphill battle because I was both a woman and a person of color, though he used a different term!

Words have power. While I used his words as motivation, they also influenced me to make decisions I shouldn’t have, especially saying yes to opportunities I thought were the safer path, even when they weren’t aligned with my true goals. If an opportunity listed ten requirements and I only met seven, I convinced myself I wasn’t qualified. Fear kept telling me it was okay to say no. Ironically, many of those were exactly the opportunities I should have said yes to.

Having a strong support system that includes my husband helped me push through many of these fears, although I still have them. He is my biggest champion, always encouraging me to step outside my comfort zone. But even his support wasn’t enough on its own. Throughout my journey, I’ve been blessed with incredible women mentors who have invested in me, challenged me, and inspired me. Listing them all would be impossible, but their impact has been profound.

Donna with friend of LISG, Liz Debenedictis

Within the M community alone, I’ve found some of the most powerful and generous women in leadership, internally at M Financial, within our Member Firms, and at partner carriers. From my first mentor and friend, Liz Debenedictis, to so many others who never once turned me away when I needed advice or a listening ear and who gave me their time, provided guidance, and made a commitment in me, I couldn’t have come as far as I have.

Having a diverse support system didn’t just help me overcome challenges, it propelled me forward and positioned me to contribute in meaningful ways. Today, I make it a priority to build relationships across the aisle, across roles, and across the industry. As a result, I’ve become the beneficiary of dynamic connections that continue to shape my journey.

One of my greatest realizations is that many leaders in our industry are remarkably gracious with their time. I’ve never hesitated to respectfully ask questions about success and, when I do, I take the most important next step: I stay quiet and listen. That’s where the magic happens.

JAY:  You and your husband, Fulton, have a lot going on outside of work.  How do you keep yourself occupied in your leisure time?

DONNA: That’s a great question, Jay, and, honestly, is there really such a thing as leisure time? The older I get, the more I’ve learned to truly value the time I have. For me, family is everything. Our son is 27, and our daughter is 25, and they are the center of my universe.

My happy place will always be near the beach, listening to the sound of the waves, while my husband, Fulton, loves the mountains. One of the best things about living in Charlotte, NC, is that we’re just a short drive from both. In three hours we can be at the coast or in the mountains.

Spending time with my family and friends reminds me to pause and breathe deeply in the middle of life’s journey. These days, I find joy in observing my children as they navigate the world. The day-to-day parenting phase is behind us, so now I focus more on listening than directing.

They’re both incredibly busy, so whenever we all come together, I cherish those moments even more.

JAY:   Congratulations on a successful interview, Donna.  You made it our famous restaurant question, and I know you have been giving this a lot of thought.   Without naming a steakhouse or a steak dish, tell me some of your favorite restaurants and what I should order when I visit.

DONNA: This might be the toughest question you’ve asked! About seven years ago, I made a commitment to take better care of myself, so I don’t eat out often when I’m at home. Instead, I love making my own veggie pizza loaded with colorful peppers, onions, mushrooms, fresh mozzarella, a mix of seasonings, and a drizzle of olive oil. On days when

I don’t feel like making dough from scratch, Trader Joe’s has the perfect pizza crust. Pair that with a glass of Riesling and a piece of dark chocolate, and I’m in heaven.

On the rare occasion I do dine out, there’s a lakefront spot nearby called North Harbor Club. The food is excellent, and the ambiance is so relaxing. It is definitely my kind of place. And if you go, trust me, the salmon will not disappoint!

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Since its inception, Life Insurance Strategies Group has solely focused on the individual high net worth life insurance market. We do not sell products. This allows us to offer unbiased, pragmatic advice. Visit us at www.lifeinsurancestrategiesgroup.com.